Player Interview: Nicolai Larsen’s lessons in leadership
This is the third part of my series on FC Nordsjælland, the Danish Superliga team with the youngest squad in Europe and the aim of competing using solely academy graduates in the first-team.
Nicolai Larsen is by no means a veteran. The FC Nordsjælland captain is only 29 years old but, in relative terms, he is one of the elder statesmen in a squad with only three players over the age of 23.
The Danish goalkeeper started his professional career at Aalborg after coming through the academy at Lyngby, FC Nordsjælland’s local rival. At Aalborg he enjoyed great success, winning both the Superliga and the Danish Cup as part of the historic double-winning team in the 2013/14 season. He was also rewarded for his part in that campaign with the 2014 Det Gyldne Bur (The Golden Cage), given to the best goalkeeper in Danish football.
He spent seven years at Aalborg before moving to Farum in 2017 to be part of the project at FC Nordsjælland. The first season was spent as back-up for Alex Rúnarsson before taking over as number 1 when Rúnarsson moved on to French side Dijon FCO. Larsen was then appointed as club captain at the start of this season after Victor Nelsson left for FC Copenhagen.
Being an experienced player in a squad with an average age of 22.5 comes with its challenges, but it also comes with a sense of responsibility and an opportunity to help those just starting to find their feet at professional level. This is a role in which Larsen has thrived, using his own experiences as a young player starting out and channelling them in a leadership role.
Despite not being an academy graduate, he possesses much of the same character traits and values that the club so heavily invests in as part of their youth education. He recently took part in a campaign with Football For A New Tomorrow, a charity he has been supporting for the last seven years, to provide communities in Sierra Leone with football equipment.
Our conversation was a fascinating one, discussing how being a father has made him a better captain, the mindset required to be a top-level athlete, and the importance of footballers having interests away from football. A long read, but an extremely interesting one — below is the transcript of what Nicolai and I discussed.
You joined FC Nordsjælland from Aalborg in 2017, what were your first impressions of the club?
The impression I had outside from playing against FC Nordsjælland was that they were a club with a lot of focus on talent development and giving young players the chance, they always had a young squad typically. So that was my first impression when I got to the club, there were a lot of young players.
I also knew that they were a very structured club in terms of how they want to build the game, how they want to defend the game, how they want to do everything in football. They have a plan all the time on how to do things, not only for the first team in the Superliga but also for the under 12’s. So they are a very structured club in terms of developing players to be ready to play in the Superliga.
I have always been pretty impressed by that but, now I am a part of it, it is even more impressive to see how structured it is. The under-12 coach almost has the same voice as the Superliga coach, they hear each other and you get your opinion [heard]. In the end it’s the Superliga coach who has the final say, of course.
Was that a big factor in you agreeing to join the club?
Yeah, it was. When I was in Aalborg — I was in Aalborg for seven or eight years — I had always been, you could say, not at the top of the hierarchy. In the end, I was pretty high up there and I played a lot of matches in Aalborg but, then again, I still wasn’t the guy with the big responsibility.
Coming to FC Nordsjælland was a difference in that sense. Now I’m the most — at that time I wasn’t the most experienced player — but right now I am the most experienced player together with Kian [Hansen]. I would say it’s a big difference.
I remember also we won the Championship in Aalborg in 2014 and, looking back on that now, the responsibility I thought I had on that team performance, it wasn’t actually that big when I look at it now.
I had some really good players, really big personalities who really took the big responsibility and the big steps in terms of leaving us, who were a little bit younger, to play football and do our thing.
Now I am looking on the other side with that responsibility, I am also responsible for making some of these young guys able to play freely in their daily work. It’s now that I actually see how big it is to be able to do that.
What were the changes in dynamic when you came from Aalborg into such a young squad at FC Nordsjælland?
I really noticed, and I also saw there was a little bit of a problem at the time, that when you came to the Superliga squad at FC Nordsjælland it was really not a senior squad, it was more like a youth team. You came from the under-19 squad to an under-21 squad, so there was not that natural hierarchy where the older players set the standard or set the tone.
You are outnumbered as an experienced player. It was pretty much the culture of the under-19’s that was taken into the Superliga squad because there were so many players coming up from the under-19’s all the time.
I actually thought that was a problem at the time because it was a big difference to Aalborg. When you came up, you had to adapt to a new professionalism and a new way of doing things, but you don’t need to do that here. When you come up to the senior team you aren’t at the bottom of the hierarchy, you don’t have the same respect in some ways.
But, then again, it’s also really nice that we have this flat hierarchy and that you can come to whoever and you can speak to everybody without being afraid of it. Everybody is equal. In some sense, I also think it’s a big positive that you can come in and you know how to play football because you did the same in the under-19’s.
In the Superliga it’s not different, it’s just a little bit of a higher level. It also makes the players more secure in themselves to come up in the Superliga squad because it’s not a big difference.
Did that make your job more difficult to set the tone as an experienced player?
Sometimes it’s more difficult but I don’t think we have so many players who try to set the tone. That’s also for myself, I’m not the most outgoing person but I like to set an example of how to do things. I’m not afraid to say to people if they are not living up to my standards or the expectations I have.
I think there is a picture of the perfect captain who is a really tough guy and when a young guy comes in he has to terrify him a little bit so he has to earn his respect. I don’t see it in that way, I want to lead by example.
I had a captain in Aalborg who was exactly the same. He was not the most outgoing person and he was not someone that was shouting a lot outside the pitch, he was shouting a lot on the pitch. You just wanted to go through fire and everything for him because he was a really good example of how to be a professional. You could always rely on him to have your back.
You also wanted to give something back to him. I want to be the same, that you can always rely on me having your back and you can say with confidence that, if I fall through, Nicolai is there to catch me so you shouldn’t be afraid of anything. I’m hoping to do the same because that was the feeling I had with him.
I also think it’s very important to be honest and direct in how you communicate. But if you just shout and shout and keep talking people won’t listen to you anymore. I think sometimes you can speak too much. If it doesn’t have any value people won’t listen to you when it actually has value.
But when you say something now, if they are not used to you speaking all the time, then they will listen when you finally have something to say. I think that’s better. Again, I’m shouting a lot on the pitch so it’s not like I’m good at being silent but it’s more like when we’re off the pitch I don’t say a lot of things. But I think and hope that when I say something people will listen.
And then everything I do, on the pitch and off the pitch, the professionalism I learned in Aalborg from a lot of great players, I hope that these players will also look at me and say ‘okay I try to take a little bit of how Nicolai was doing it to become a better player’.
In your experience of being a goalkeeper and a captain, how different is it leading these younger players on the pitch?
I don’t think age is a big issue, it’s really down to personality. Of course, your personality develops through the years and how many games you have. If you’ve played 200 matches as a 25-year-old or you’ve played 100 matches as a 35-year-old, you are more experienced as a 25-year-old.
I think, of course, there’s a big difference with a 19-year-old because for them it’s still pretty new so I will be a little bit more helpful, maybe shouting a little bit more. It really comes down to the person. Some 19-year-olds also shout a lot so then it doesn’t make sense for me to shout a lot.
If I have a 35-year-old in front of me [who has] maybe played three or four hundred matches but doesn’t say a lot, it still takes something from me to speak a little bit more. It depends on the dynamic of the team I really think, that’s the big thing.
Good leadership is looking at how the dynamic is and where I can do a little bit more. I think it depends on how the team is, which players do I have in front of me, and what do they expect from me. Maybe I have to push on some buttons and turn some down because the one in front of me can actually do it, so maybe I can put the focus on another thing.
Do the young players come to you and ask you for advice?
I give some advice when I feel like they need it. I’ve also experienced some of the guys coming to ask something, it can be anything. Most of all I am just trying to speak from my experience when we have a team meeting. We have a meeting every morning where our coach will ask us some different things, it could be tactical or private stuff.
I always try to speak from the heart and from my experience because I also remember how it was coming in as a 19-year-old to a new squad and having to learn a lot of things. You get some perspective on life and how you did your own thing. I know that what helped me might also help somebody else if they know at that time.
It’s a balance, again, not to speak too much. Most of the time I just show by example, doing extra training or helping somebody if I see that they need a little bit of help.
Did you have that when you were coming through as a 19-year-old?
Yeah, I did. I played under-17 and 19 in Lyngby and I had a goalkeeper who was both in the Superliga and also in the second division. His name was Rune Pedersen and he actually played for Nottingham Forest. He was a great guy and he really tried to help me a lot when I was a young guy training with them.
I took some of the things that he was speaking about and really learned from him and put it into the same here when we have goalkeeper training with an under-19 or under-17 goalkeeper. I’m trying to speak to them about these kinds of things.
When I moved to Aalborg at the start of my senior career there were four or five guys there who were really good at taking care of people coming in from outside, always offering their help and [telling me] if I needed something I could just ask.
I was really lucky to come into this squad because they were really helpful and really good at seeing if somebody was having some trouble. I also learned a little bit about that and taking it in the way I am because I’m not that outgoing. They were, but I can still help in some way.
They really helped me when I was starting to become a professional football player because I didn’t know what it took to become good or to do these kinds of things. I didn’t realise it before I went to Aalborg. It was there I really learned it by looking at these other players and especially also my colleague Karim Zaza.
He was an old goalkeeper at that time and played a lot of Superliga matches and also won some Championships. He played for Brondby, Odense, and also Aalborg of course.
Just by looking at him, how he was training, always very professional, I learned a lot by looking at him how much it takes just to be at this level. It takes a lot of work. So I was really lucky to come into this squad because I really learned a lot from these guys.
What do you think the most important lesson was that you learned from those players?
That every training session is important. Everything you do, all the small work you do, it can take ten or fifteen minutes, it can become a big step in the end. For me, it was a big lesson that when you are thinking ‘this is easy training’ or ‘I just want to go home’, you can’t afford that at this level.
You can have a bad day, but you cannot have a bad training [session] because, in the end, it will punish you. They were always ready to train.
How they switch on and off also, to see them tease each-other and fool around ten/fifteen minutes before training and then suddenly it was like they switched on the light and they were just totally focused on what was ahead of us. Seeing that professional mindset was really good for me. It takes a lot of energy when you’re not used it, so I learned a lot of that from them.
It’s so important when you’re done with the training to be able to leave the training. If you had a good training or bad training it’s important to say ‘okay this is yesterday, what are we going to do tomorrow and how can I prepare for that?’. You cannot use what you did, you can only use what you are going to do or what you are doing now. I thought it was really fascinating at the time.
I used a lot of energy to be able to switch on and switch off because sometimes when I came home I thought about the training. You cannot do that because you have to also rest your mind, you have to go out and be together with your friends. It’s also mental, you have to rest the mind too sometimes just to be able to play football. It sounds strange but it really is a big thing.
That’s an important point of not letting the bad training sessions get you down but also not letting the good ones lead to complacency.
One of the things I heard from a young guy I played with in Aalborg, he’s actually not playing football anymore, but he said that the most difficult part for him was the expectations. Not the expectations of the game but the expectations of the training. When he looked at some of the other guys, they were just training at this high level all the time, every day. That was the most difficult part for him to keep that consistency all day every day.
I really think he had a good point in that it is difficult to keep the same level every day. I say to some of these guys it’s nice that you’ve played one good season, of course, you should be happy and take all the confidence. But to become a really good player you need to do this five, six, seven times in a row. It’s not only just playing two good matches and then one bad, you need to play 30 good matches. It’s all about the consistency, that’s how you get through as a football player.
There are some players that have played 100 Superliga matches but, if you cannot keep the level, you will just go away again and you will never get to 200 Superliga matches. It doesn’t matter when you get to 100, I would say it’s more impressive to play top-level football as a 28/29-year-old than it is as an 18-year-old. When you are 18, in these days, you will always get the chance. But when you are 28/29? No. You will not get the chance unless you are good enough.
What do you do to switch off from football?
For me I have my kids, so we do all sorts of stuff, but I am actually studying at the university at the moment. I already finished an education in economics when I was in Aalborg and now I am studying a bachelor's in economics at the university here. You don’t necessarily need to do some schoolwork as I do, I just like studying.
But you can also do something — they have a lot of focus on it in Aalborg and I also read your article on Maxwell [Woledzi] — like give-back projects. I think it’s so important to have something else than football. He has that give-back project and in Nordsjælland they have a lot of focus on this. It’s different than football, it’s something you really need to go into, so you have something other than football to think about.
For me, I think that education is the easiest way to get that, to find something that you can find some success in. I know that in every footballer’s career you will get ups and downs, and especially in the downs, it’s really nice to have something that’s not football that you can get some success in.
I experienced the same when I finished my education in economics. I had a down-time in my career and I didn’t really have something to find some success. I had my son at that time to do something else and to get my mind on something else, but I really didn’t have that feeling of success. So that’s why I started to study again, I really needed that.
It’s a big part of the mental restitution and the mental part of being a human being that you need some place to blow off steam sometimes. For me, that’s education. It can be anything, it could be the Hijab Project, it could be that you coach some younger kids in football, it could be that you coach somebody in tennis, you could walk your neighbour’s dog.
Something where you feel like you have responsibility for something, something that you can do besides football. Something you like, something you love to do.
For Gareth Bale, it’s golfing. For a lot of other players, it’s golfing. I’ve been there myself, I also golfed, and I think it’s a great way to get your mind on something else while you also get the competition. I really understand why so many footballers are playing golf, I really do. It’s really good for you mentally. So I did the same before I got kids, now I don’t have the same time so I’m back to the books!
What has changed in the way you view football since having children?
First of all, the structure in my daily life, the daily routine. I have always been a very structured guy, I knew when to go to sleep and I knew when to eat and things like that.
When you get kids it’s not always like that, you have to change a lot of things. It was really difficult for me at the beginning, but I think it’s better for sportspeople that you are able to perform no matter the preparation.
If you cannot perform [unless] you slept exactly 8 hours and 23 minutes, you have to eat 4 hours before the match, all these things — of course try to make it as structured as possible — but you should also be able to play whenever. Whenever they say, you should be able to play.
For me, that’s the biggest difference. Now I’m more ready all the time because you just adapt to your kids instead of adapting to what you’re thinking for yourself is the best. I think it’s a good thing in the long-term.
And then the mental part. When you had a bad match or you lost a game or whatever, my son doesn’t care and my daughter doesn’t care. Most of the time they are just happy to see me.
It was really difficult in the beginning when I got kids because of the way I am, how structured I am. But I really think that having kids benefitted me a lot as a person but also as a football player. Especially the leadership part, I think I’m even better because I’ve got kids.
Now I can see it more from another person’s perspective, from my kid’s perspective. I have to read their feelings and everything like that, I wasn’t used to that before.
I wasn’t focusing as much on how others might feel or think but I am now in terms of leadership, in terms of reading people and what they need to perform even better. Taking care of kids every day, you actually learn that, because I’ve never been good at that.
- Feel free to leave any feedback/suggestions below or on my twitter.
- Football For A New Tomorrow is a charity aiming to make change and development in Sierra Leone through community sport association based on the Danish Association model.
- Find Nicolai Larsen on Instagram here.
- Find FC Nordsjælland on Instagram here, link to their website here.
